Mr Ramesh Ramachandran (anchor): Hello and welcome. I am Ramesh Ramachandran. You are watching a special broadcast here on DD India. I have with me a special guest, Ambassador D B Venkatesh Varma, who is India’s Ambassador to Russia.
Ambassador Varma, welcome to DD India.
Ambassador DB Venkatesh Varma: Mr. Ramachandran, thank you so much for giving me an opportunity to speak on the occasion of the 20th Anniversary of Strategic Partnership between India and Russia.
Mr Ramachandran: Indeed. Welcome Ambassador Varma. Just a quick word about my guest for the benefit of viewers, who might be tuning in from around the world. Ambassador Varma is a career diplomat. He is in the Indian Foreign Service and he has presented his credentials to the Russian President in September 2018. Now he has spent many years in Indian Foreign Service. He was Ambassador to Spain. He was also handling Disarmament Affairs in the Ministry of External Affairs. In fact he was Ambassador to the Conference of Disarmament as well. By the way, he is the first recipient of S K Singh Award of Excellence in the Indian Foreign Service in 2010, for his contribution to the negotiations of the Civil Nuclear Initiative. Ambassador Varma, welcome once again to DD India.
Let’s now talk a bit about the 20th anniversary of the India-Russia partnership that was on the 3rd of October this year. Now, how do you look at the two decade long relationship starting with the Strategic Partnership in the year 2000 and graduating now to the Special and Privileged Partnership? Would you like to give an overview to our viewers about the last two decades?
Ambassador: This month, 20 years ago, PM Atal Bihari Vajpayee and President Vladimir Putin signed the Declaration of Strategic Partnership. In 2010, this was upgraded further to a Special and Privileged Partnership. This is a partnership in its truest sense, special and privileged. It is strategic because it deals with core issues and it deals with long term interest of both countries.
Mr Ramachandran: Let’s now talk a bit about the specific areas of cooperation. We could discuss political ties, trade and investment, defense and security, energy, so on and so forth. Let’s start with the state of play in defense cooperation. How would you describe current relations as far as defense goes, and how do you see the role of the Russian manufacturers in PM Modi’s flagship enterprise- Make in India?
Ambassador: Well indeed. PM Modi enjoys excellent personal relations with President Putin. They have met 22 times since 2014. They have spoken 4 times this year on the telephone. President Putin greeted PM Modi on his birthday. PM Modi reciprocated this gesture and congratulated President Putin on 7th of October. So taking forward this special and privileged relationship between our two leaders is indeed a great asset. In fact, I think it is the most important asset in this very complex world, when we have leaders of both countries taking care of the relationship in a long term perspective. I think that gives a certain amount of stability and predictability that would not be otherwise available.
India and Russia enjoy a number of pillars which have been traditional pillars, defense being one of them. You may recall that in 1962, when we had a border problem with China, there were Mi-4 helicopters of Soviet origin which were transporting our troops to Ladakh. Many decades later, we face a similar situation of protecting our interests and supporting our troops. A lot of Russian origin equipment is being deployed there. PM Modi has emphasized that this old traditional relationship has to be modernized and diversified. One area of diversification is defense and defense production. More than 60-70% of India’s Armed Forces draw their equipment from Russia. We have signed an Agreement, that henceforth, spare parts for Russian origin equipment will be manufactured in India. One of the flagship programmes for ‘Make in India’ defense sector is the Agreement between the two countries for the manufacture of Kalashnikov AK-203, which is one of the most modern assault rifles in the world that will be manufactured in Korwa in UP as part of ‘Make in India’ programme. The ‘Make in India’ programme will go forward with the active support and participation of the Russian defense industry and this is one of the main items of cooperation and priorities for the future.
Mr Ramachandran: And talking about defense ties, Ambassador Varma, there are some media reports in Russia which says that both countries could launch a new BrahMos Missile by 2024, and that the same missile could be shared with third countries. Also Russia might not be inclined to have a defense relation with other countries in India’s neighborhood. So in that context, what’s next on the agenda, so to speak, or the next big idea in India-Russia defense security cooperation specifically?
Ambassador: As the historical record shows, Russia has exercised restraint in supplying combat equipment to one of our neighbors and that is a very positive element in our relationship. With respect to BrahMos, as you would recall, it is one of the most successful joint ventures in our bilateral relationship. It was launched with the blessings of our former President Dr. Abdul Kalam, who was the Guiding Spirit of the BrahMos program. Today, the BrahMos program has evolved into one of the best cruise missile programs in the world; this has been accepted by all our three services and naturally, there is great interest from third countries to import BrahMos Missiles produced as a result of the joint venture that is established in India. Now, joint ventures are the way to move forward. There is great interest in Russian defense industry to cooperate with the defense industry in India, both in the private sector and in the public sector to go forward and establish joint ventures for the future. We expect joint ventures not only to be established for the manufacture of spare parts, but for full weapon systems, and the Defense Production Procedures that were announced just a few weeks ago, provide great opportunity for Russian industry and we see a lot of enthusiasm emerging from the Russian defence industry to come and partner with India, their traditional partner, but a partner with growing technological capabilities, a very positive investment environment, as well as a great opportunity to explore third country markets. The BrahMos Missile will be taken forward for third country exports consistent with our interests, our political and security interest and of course,our export control procedures.
Mr Ramachandran: Ambassador Varma, another pillar of the bilateral ties is Energy. Now would you like to share with our viewers and give them a sense of where things stand today insofar as cooperation in hydrocarbons goes, cooperation on the civil nuclear side of the relationship? Also off late, India has taken interest in Russia's Far East as well.
Ambassador: Indeed many of your viewers would recall that it was with Soviet assistance that the first exploration projects in India yielded positive results in our oil and gas sector. ONGC, and other our public sector enterprises in the energy sector have long-standing relations with Russia.
Similarly, we have long-standing relations in terms of investments in the Russian energy sector. Sakhalin-I investment, which was made in the early 2000s, has today yielded more benefits than any other foreign investment made by India globally. So, that is an example of how India-Russia relations can yield extremely good benefits for our country's interests. Subsequently, India has invested more than $13bn in the Russian energy industry. Be it Sakhalin-I, be it Vankor, be it Taas Yuriakh, Imperial Energy and in other sectors. Today, GAIL has established a long-term relationship with Gazprom for supply for LNG. Similarly, Rosneft has a long time supply relationship with our Ministry of Petroleum & Natural Gas. We are looking for Russian participation in our energy sector and our domestic gas sector including the use of LNG for transportation. As we move forward within the next decade, more and more of our cars and trucks in India will run on LNG. There is great interest in Russia with our experience with CNG. As you know, one of the most successful ventures in Delhi has been the conversion of public transport into CNG and there is great interest in Russia in learning from the experience that India has in this sector.
Similarly in terms of coking coal, we see our steel industry looking for predictable, long-term commercially competitive supply arrangements and we are presently working on that.
The nuclear sector is, again, very important. We may recall that Russia reached out to us to support India at a time when there were severe nuclear restrictions applicable to India. This was several decades ago and the Kudankulam project was conceived at a time of great difficulty for India. But, since then much has moved, much has changed for India, for the India-Russia relationship and as well as in India’s standing in the international system. India-Russia are also engaging in cooperating in the Rooppur nuclear power plant project in Bangladesh and there is great interest on the part of our friends from Bangladesh to involve India in a more extended way in cooperation with Russia, taking forward our cooperation. Similarly, there is such interest from the Gulf, from Central Asia and from Africa.
We see a lot of cooperation that is possible in mutual investments in the Russian Arctic. As you know, we have already invested in Vankor; there is great interest in the Eastern cluster. The Eastern cluster is a project of oil and gas in the Russian Arctic which will keep Russia as one of the largest energy producers well into the next century. We see three major clusters of energy producers -one is in the Gulf area, the second is Russia, the third is the United States and for our energy security, India is keen that we cooperate and engage with all three and I'm very happy to inform you that our progress with Russia is very, very encouraging.
As you recall, Prime Minister Modi was the Chief Guest at the Eastern Economic Forum meeting in September 2019; when he announced that India would be actively engaged with the Russian Far East. In fact, he announced a new policy called the Act Far East policy, part of which involves our interest and engagement with Russia not just with the Russian Far East but also the Arctic. We envisage an Energy Bridge not just from Vladivostok, but from Yamal to Vladivostok, and Vladivostok to Chennai, to our Eastern seaports. These are moving forward and I am very confident that Russia will continue to be a major partner for us in the energy sector in the decades to come.
Mr Ramachandran: Ambassador Varma, how is the cooperation in the area of space coming along? For instance, Russia is also training the Indian astronauts for the Gaganyaan mission.
Ambassador: Well, space is one area of cooperation that excites both the young and old alike, across the world, and our people in India and Russia are no exception. There are those of us who remember that our first two satellites – Aryabhatta and Bhaskara were launched on top of Soviet space craft. Rakesh Sharma, who is a hero for many, was launched on a Soviet space launch vehicle. These are the old bonds of friendship that are blossoming into new frontiers of cooperation.
In 2018, in Prime Minister’s presence, we signed an MoU with Russia for cooperation in the field of human space exploration. As part of that, I am happy to report that there are four smart, professional Indian Air Force officers presently undergoing training at the Gagarin Cosmonaut training centre outside Moscow. They have been here throughout this year, and despite the COVID pandemic, their training program has progressed unimpeded. I had an opportunity to meet them. I must say a very impressive set of pilots; I am sure they will do our country proud. They have been highly assessed by the Russian instructors who are very, very impressed by their dedication and professionalism. They complete their training in Russia in March 2021, and will continue their further training in India as we move forward for the launch of the Gaganyaan human space program during the year of the 75th anniversary of our Independence, as had been announced by our PM.
Mr Ramachandran: Let’s talk a bit now, Ambassador Varma, if you will, about Trade and Investment ties, especially science and technology, and also in the post-COVID world, is there scope for collaboration between Moscow and New Delhi on the post-COVID situation, especially in the area of vaccines for instance?
Ambassador: Well our economic relations have been doing well, relatively well. We had considerable improvement in our trade relations last year. We had reached about $10.5bn. There have been some excellent growth areas. Unfortunately, these growth areas took a hit this year; but we are no exception to the downturn in global trade that has happened across the board. But we hope to have a rebound in relations in 2021. The new areas of cooperation include agro-industry, pharma. India has proven to the world that the pharmaceutical sector is one of our greatest strengths. There is great interest in Russia to cooperate with the Indian pharma industry to take this forward.
Cyber, Artificial intelligence, moving forward, is another area of great interest. There is great interest in Russia that India is well positioned to be one of the cyber and digital superpowers in the coming decade. We have the cheapest digital costs anywhere in the world; we have immense talent; our Unicorns are deeply innovative. We have equally good talent, so a marriage between Russia and India in the cyber and digital sectors will yield tremendous results. During the COVID pandemic, I think, the true strength of both countries have come to the fore. Despite the COVID pandemic restrictions, India supplied over 80 tonnes of medical supplies and equipment to Russia, and it was greatly appreciated here. In fact, the Kremlin issued a special statement appreciating PM Modi’s initiative to supply hydroxychloroquine at a time when there was great shortage across the world.
Both India and Russia, their leaders have announced, that their production of vaccines in India, the vaccines that we produce along with foreign partners, are not just for our own consumption, but for the betterment of humanity. That being the case, I think we see the partnership between India & Russia as one of our most relevant partnerships, as we go forward and take on the continuing challenge posed by the COVID pandemic the world over.
Mr Ramachandran: Ambassador Varma, India and Russia also cooperate and collaborate on regional and global issues as well. In the context of multilateral cooperation, how do you look at India-Russia ties, say in the Russia-India-China trilateral format, or the Russia-Iran-India, or the Russia-Iran-China trilateral at the same time? Also India-Russia within the BRICS family, so to speak or the SCO, as well as in the United Nations?
Ambassador: Well, this year and the coming two years will be very important for India’s engagement on the multilateral stage for a couple of reasons. Firstly, this year, our good friend Russia has been the chair of the SCO and BRICS formats and despite the COVID pandemic, meetings at the Foreign Ministers’ level and other Ministerial levels have taken place. As a special gesture, our External Affairs Minister Dr. Jaishankar and our Raksha Mantri Shri Rajnath Singh visited Russia despite the COVID complications to attend the meetings that had been organized by Russia as the Chair of the SCO. This is an indication of the very special regard that India holds, with respect to the Chairmanship of Russia, during its Chairmanship of the SCO. We look forward to the Summit meetings of the SCO and the BRICS in November. These will take place through video conferences given the restrictions still applicable because of the COVID pandemic. Our Prime Minister will be participating in the SCO Summit on video conference on 10th November. On 17th November, the BRICS Summit will take place.
India will be hosting the meeting of Heads of Government towards the end of November and Russia has been hugely supportive of our priorities that we wish to take forward, in the context of meeting of the Heads of Government that will take place in Delhi, either physically or through video conference. That said, next year, India will be holding the Chair of the RIC. External Affairs Minister Dr. Jaishankar visited Russia for the SCO meeting, but on the sidelines, he had a meeting of the RIC Foreign Ministers. The baton was handed over by Foreign Minister Lavrov to Dr. Jaishankar. We will be taking this forward next year. Similarly, India will be the Chair of the BRICS next year. In 2022, we will also be holding the chair of the G20.
From January next year, India will be joining other members of the Security Council for a two year tenure on the Council. In all these fora, which are very relevant in this very complex and disturbed world, our partnership with Russia on global priorities is absolutely critical. The Russian side is hugely positive on India’s role. Russia continues to support India’s permanent membership of the Security Council. There is absolutely no change in Russia’s position. So going forward, I think there are a number of issues on which India and Russia can cooperate and these platforms will indeed act as a multiplier factor for further deepening our engagement on regional and global issues.
Mr Ramachandran: In conclusion, Ambassador Varma, I want to come back to the idea of the Special and Privileged Strategic Partnership between India and Russia. In that context, are we looking at high level visits to or from New Delhi, especially the date and venue of the next India-Russia annual bilateral Summit? Also how do you see the prospects for an informal summit between the two leaders of India and Russia, similar to the May 2018 summit held at Sochi in Russia?
Ambassador: Well, as you are aware, our Prime Minister has already extended an invitation for President Putin to visit India. Originally, the visit was to have been held this month, in terms of the regular schedule. But the regular schedules of all leaders have been set aside because of the COVID pandemic. When the two leaders spoke to each other, they indicated that the Summit stands. There will be a visit by President Putin to India for the bilateral summit, but the dates for which will be fixed separately. So, we look forward to the visit of President Putin to India for the bilateral summit. He has already visited India 8 times, which is in itself quite a record for world leaders. That is not surprising at all, given the extraordinary support and importance that President Putin has attached to relations with India.
Prime Minister Modi enjoys an extraordinary personal rapport with world leaders. Among them, with President Putin. It has now become a tradition in India-Russia relations, for the two leaders to have a conversation between themselves, on bilateral issues, regional issues, on global issues. This happened in Sochi. This happened in Vladivostok and I will not be surprised at all, if Prime Minister Modi invites President Putin and they have a conversation of the nature that they had in Sochi, (during the future Summit).
I would say that India-Russia relations are poised for further growth in the decades to come. They have the strength of an old Banyan tree, which has very deep roots, but an old Banyan tree also constantly sprouts new branches - diversification of our strategic partnership, strengthening of the traditional pillars of defense, energy, nuclear and space into regional cooperation, into scientific cooperation, into cooperation involving our youth. Prime Minister Modi has paid particular attention to this aspect. He visited Sochi to visit gifted students at the SIRIUS centre. We have established cooperation with the Atal Innovation Mission where extraordinarily talented students from the Indian side have come together on two occasions and on both occasions, the talent pool both on the Russian side, and the Indian side was considered to be quite extraordinary. So these are the new bridges to the future.
The new bridge to the future is the commonality of our interests, the solidarity that we show to each other at difficult times, the commitment by our leaders and the extraordinary positive sentiment that exists at the level of the people, both in India and in Russia. With all these coming together, we are very confident that as we celebrate the 20th Anniversary of our Strategic Partnership, we can look forward to the next 20 years with great hope, with great confidence, for the success of our bilateral relations.
Mr Ramachandran:Indeed. On that note, Ambassador Varma, thank you so much for making the time to be with us on DD India. Thank you for your time.
Ambassador: Thank you very much Mr. Ramachandran, and thank you very much for giving me this opportunity.
